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Post by Seven on Jul 30, 2020 6:43:57 GMT -6
Anyone out there try to make an Italian pilsner? From what I'm reading, it's influenced by a traditional German pils but with more late and dry hop additions. Pivo Pils is probably the best known American example of the style. I'm thinking:
German Pils Cara-something (I think I only have CaraPils on hand) A smidge of Vienna if I only have CaraPils 1.050 25-30 IBU Edelweiss in the WP and DH
For yeast, I thought I had some slurry of 34/70 but I must have retired it. I only have a new sachet of S-189 in the fridge.
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Post by Ken on Jul 30, 2020 7:02:06 GMT -6
Paging passenger Poptop. Paging Mr. Mike Poptop. Please report to the Italian Pilsner thread in the recipe concourse. There is either a thread about this already or else Poptop and I were exchanging emails about it. An article in BEER & BREWING mentioned this and something about Birrificio Italiano’s Tipopils. There are a lot of Google results for this too including THIS. I don't really want to DH a pilsner but dang it... it sounds like such an awesome beer.
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Post by Seven on Jul 30, 2020 7:07:03 GMT -6
Thanks, Ken...I thought I remembered a thread here too but I couldn't find it, at least not in the Recipe forum. Maybe I should widen my search parameters.
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Post by Ken on Jul 30, 2020 7:26:20 GMT -6
I read up on some of this stuff and what got me was that the pils is DH'd but they still use noble hops (well, Saphir was mentioned too) and they don't overdo the DHing. I tried Pivo Pils when it first came out and really liked it and also tried to brew something similar but the late Saphir that I used created a pretty 'grassy' finish in the beer. I was not overly familiar with Saphir at the time. This conversation also prompted me to make a pilsner last week. It was all Hallertau (and not DH'd) but I used two ounces of Hallertau in the WP so the finish is crisp. I'm looking forward to someone on the board attempting this and hearing their thoughts. I actually went to my local bottle shop to get Pivo Pils for Poptop (he can't get it) and they were OUT OF IT!
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Post by poptop on Jul 30, 2020 7:35:40 GMT -6
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Post by poptop on Jul 30, 2020 7:39:33 GMT -6
Seven, I sent you a PM. Same info I emailed Ken
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Post by Seven on Jul 30, 2020 8:05:04 GMT -6
OK, I'm doing this! I might not have enough Weyerman pils but I can supplement with Vienna and Golden Promise in addition to a bit of CaraPils. Hopping with be with Edelweiss which is a blend of 5 or 6 American-grown nobles so it should work well here...and it's the only "lager" hop I have in the arsenal right now. For mashing, seems like a good candidate for a step mash but I've done never a proper one. Now that I have the Anvil Foundry, this will be easy. Thoughts on step temps? Maybe a Hockhurtz?
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Post by poptop on Jul 30, 2020 8:28:17 GMT -6
^^ never stepped. Gonna keep a keen eye on this thread
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Post by Ken on Jul 30, 2020 8:49:43 GMT -6
If you look at THIS article, (great article btw and it makes me want to brew RIGHT NOW!) there is some step mash information from Eric Toft of Schonram brewery. That should get you started.
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Post by Seven on Jul 30, 2020 13:02:36 GMT -6
That's a lot of steps! Something I just read states to start the mash at room temp and then raise to a couple step points. I've often thought about doing this but never took the leap...maybe now I will! I'll put together a recipe this weekend and post it on here. It probably won't deviate much from my 1st post but I'll get more detailed on the hopping. I guess I should make sure that I have enough Edelweiss before I get too far ahead of myself. Ferm temps may be an issue but I should be able to get down into the 60s to start.
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Post by Seven on Aug 3, 2020 14:58:17 GMT -6
I didn't get to brew this today...decided to not take a last minute vacation day and opted to work instead. I'm off next week so I'm targeting next Monday.
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Post by Ken on Aug 3, 2020 15:46:24 GMT -6
Poptop, was there ever a mention as to what yeast is preferred in a recipe like this? I sort of feel like 2124/34-70 might not be right but honestly I'm not sure. I feel like S-189 would produce a crisper beer and 34-70 might produce a more malty beer but clearly yeast is not the only contributor of 'crispness'. Seven, I will be watching this very closely because I have to admit that I am intrigued by the idea. I am really not a DH fan but I am a pilsner fan and I could see me doing something like this and maybe dialing down the DH addition or something. I also would NOT want a cloudy pilsner (which I could see happening with a standard DH) so what I would consider is brewing the beer as usual and getting the fermenter out of the fridge on day 8 or something (I'm making this up) and then dropping a muslin bag into the fermenter and letting it sit for another 2-3 days and then transferring to keg, chill, gel, carb. That could be a really nice beer. Obviously those dry hops would need to be something pilsnery (Hallertau, Tettnanger, etc) and fresh, fresh, fresh. Please keep us posted.
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Post by Seven on Aug 3, 2020 16:01:20 GMT -6
Not Poptop but I believe the brewer of Tipopils recommends 34/70. I will have to check again though. I believe that he also ferments a little warmer than traditional German methods to promote some additional esters. Late/dry hopping is very light so it's not a hop bomb by any stretch.
Ken, have you had Prima Pils from Victory? It's a German style pils but it carries a pretty nice hop flavor and aroma, at least when fresh.
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Post by Ken on Aug 3, 2020 16:45:55 GMT -6
I've had Prima Pils a couple times... it's always cloudy which turns me off. Is that normal or did I get some mishandled beer? I saw a picture of the Tipopils from Birrificio Italiano and it looked clear so they either filter it or they just have a way to clarify it somehow... I assume they wouldn't want it lagering too long or the fresh hop flavor would disappear.
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Post by Ken on Aug 3, 2020 17:09:27 GMT -6
I just took another look at the article and recipe. The pils plus CaraMunich is wild, isn't it? I'm wasn't sure the 1.4 ounces would be enough so I rounded to 2 ounces and also added two ounces of copper malt (sue me!). Also, I do not have Saphir or Perle but I do have the Northern Brewer and the Spalt. So I envisioned Northern Brewer for the first addition and then Spalt and Sterling for the rest of the recipe. I would also use Bayern as I have it running and I may take a stab at this. I also had to do a bit of a dance with the 2nd hop addition because I'm doing a 30m boil. The remaining beers I have drawn up for this Bayern are a Czech Pils w/Saaz, a Red Lager, a Vienna Lager and now this Tipopils. That would make NINE batches with the Bayern yeast.
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