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Post by Ken on Jun 18, 2020 10:44:05 GMT -6
No, I don't want to make cheese. But I am a fan of cheese and no day is complete without some good cheese. Pepper Jack, Havarti, Gouda, some plain old cheddar, chipotle, etc. The question I have is... how do various cheeses get their signature flavor? Why does Swiss taste that way? How does Gouda get its flavor? Anything with dill or peppers or whatever, I get that part... pick a cheese with a more neutral flavor and add whatever you want. But take Parmesan... where does the flavor we know come from?
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Post by Leftympfrmde on Jun 18, 2020 10:54:35 GMT -6
Id assume its like beer: The Terroir, sources and method prepping the milk, the bugs you use for fermentation, method of aging/storage, and what kind of funk develops.
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Post by drez on Jun 18, 2020 10:57:08 GMT -6
Deerslyr is your guy. Pretty sure he just did some sweet looking pepper jack from the pictures I saw on FB.
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deerslyr
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Post by deerslyr on Jun 18, 2020 11:56:44 GMT -6
It's amazing that most of the recipes have exactly the same ingredients... 2 gallons milk, 1/2 teaspoon calcium chloride, 1/2 tablet of rennet, and either a culture of mesophilic or thermophilic. Temp will vary for meso or thermo for the curds. After that is where the distinction lies. Some curds are cut earlier than others... anywhere between 45 minutes and 90 minutes. The temp and frequency of stirring the whey after cutting the curds factor in. A lot of it has to do with moisture content and acidity. Just did a Gouda, which is a washed curd cheese, meaning whey is taken off during the process and replaced with water at a certain temp. Lowers the acidity. The size of cuts in the curds can make a difference. Anywhere between 1/4 inch cubes and 1 inch cubes. It's pretty crazy.
The weight and time of pressing a cheese makes a difference too.
Some cheeses have specialty ingredients. Bleu has a mold that is added to it, while there is another mold that gives Swiss its bubbles via gas.
If you are interested in reading about the process and look at some recipes, go to the library and pick up Home Cheese Making by Ricki Carroll. This would be very much like someone interested in beer brewing picking up How To Brew by Palmer. Some cheeses do not need a press. I've got a Shropshire cheese that is ready, but have not cut into yet. It's like a soft cheddar with bleu mold veins. It did not need a press. Just a $7 cheese basket.
For the record... I hate making mozarella.
But to answer the question... by and large the three variables are temperature, time and pressing weight. It's more about process than ingredients (unless special molds and whatnot are needed).
Just made a mascarpone cheese last night for my son to use in a recipe for ravioli he is making tonight.
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deerslyr
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Post by deerslyr on Jun 18, 2020 12:01:27 GMT -6
I also found a source for some raw milk, so the last two batches have a minimum of 3 months aging before they are considered "safe" to consume. Doesn't help that my cousin is an epidemiologist for the State and would kick my ass from Madison to Chicago if she ever found out. :-)
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Post by Ken on Jun 18, 2020 12:14:22 GMT -6
See? Deerslyr clearly has some kind of device that lets him know if he's needed somewhere. How did he know?  So there is nothing specific to getting Swiss that sort of tang that you taste? Parmesan in all its forms are all made in a similar way? I watched a documentary on cooking on Netflix where they made parmesan with Red Cow milk. Supposed to be pretty badass. |
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deerslyr
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Post by deerslyr on Jun 18, 2020 20:04:44 GMT -6
Swiss does have something called Propionic Shermanii powder in it, which in addition to the holes, gives it its distinct flavor. In a late stage of cheese production, the propionibacteria consume the lactic acid excreted by the other bacteria and release acetate, propionic acid, and carbon dioxide gas. The acetate and propionic acid give Swiss its nutty and sweet flavor. But the powder is like one of maybe half a dozen things that could be added to a cheese to change it. And most of those are for specialized cheeses, like Swiss, Limburger, Bleu, etc. By and large, your cheddar, gouda, colby, parmesan and several others don't have that add in. Think of it like the difference between an IPA and a Belgian. Both have the same base ingredients and hops, but then a Belgian has that added sugar.
Also, parmesan can be made from skim milk (as well as whole milk), but the same cannot be said of cheddar.
Next time I get raw milk, I plan on making another parmesan because it ages for a minimum of 10 months.
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Post by Seven on Jun 19, 2020 7:00:53 GMT -6
Isn't the milk typically heated when making cheese? Would it still be considered "raw" at that point?
I have a source of raw milk a few miles from my house...last time I bought, I think it was $3.50/gallon but it's been probably 3-5 years. Made microwave "ricotta' with it a couple times.
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deerslyr
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Post by deerslyr on Jun 19, 2020 7:23:43 GMT -6
No. Depending on the recipe for most pressed cheeses, it only gets heated in a range from 90 or 120. Well below pasteurization temps. There are some soft, fresh cheeses that can be heated up to the 170-180 range, but still well below. Much like heat and yeast, heat is mortal to the cultures.
In Wisconsin, it is illegal to sell raw milk, but a Dairy could sell it as an incidental. My source just gives me 2 gallons for free.
Unless you are absolutely certain about the health of the animals, I would avoid making fresh cheeses with raw milk. Lysteria is an illness you don't want to mess around with. That being said... there are a number of cheeses that you could make without using a cheese press that you could age for 90 or more days.
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Post by pkrone on Jun 25, 2020 18:58:28 GMT -6
We make mozzarella when we make pizza, but that's about it. My wife's done some cheddar which was really good. Her latest cotija was quite good too.
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