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Post by Leftympfrmde on May 18, 2020 21:04:57 GMT -6
Reading some LoDo brewing methods, and came across this method of threading your strike and sparge water with 2 gram per gallon of a bread yeast and dextrose. Sounds simple enough, and takes the hassle of boiling water and allowing to cool down before using.
Anyone have real world experience with this? How long do I wait for this process to work.
Just LoDo curious. 😁
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Post by Ken on May 18, 2020 22:45:31 GMT -6
I did it on every batch for about a year. On the homebrew level (for me, approx. 8 gallons of water for a 5 gallon batch) it took about 2 hours to work. But that was information that I was given. I do not have a DO meter so I can't tell you what levels of O2 were in the water when I started brewing with it. I also stopped that practice maybe 10 batches ago and I have noticed NO difference. When I started using the yeast + sugar mixture it was in tandem with a bunch of other LO steps... most of which I still do.
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Post by drez on May 19, 2020 5:29:25 GMT -6
Like Ken I did it and no longer do. I thought my beers came out worse with it, could be that I love oxidized beers  . They did some studies on another board and I think the time to 0ppm was 20 minutes. |
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Post by jkor on May 19, 2020 5:50:07 GMT -6
I'm so out of the loop on this low oxygen brewing. I think I'll keep it that way. It reminds me of being on the lightweight backpacking forums where people are shaving down the handles of their travel toothbrush and cutting rolls of TP in half to save grams on their pack weight. Although, cutting rolls of TP in half is probably pretty useful in general, right now.  |
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Post by zymot on May 19, 2020 6:51:47 GMT -6
Has a low 02 brewer made a vacuum chamber for their mash tun yet? I expect it would not be hard to do. I do not think you would have to take heroic measures and the vacuum pump would not have to be a monster to get the job done.
While you are at it, go electric and boil your wort under a vacuum as well.
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Post by drez on May 19, 2020 7:28:28 GMT -6
Has a low 02 brewer made a vacuum chamber for their mash tun yet? I expect it would not be hard to do. I do not think you would have to take heroic measures and the vacuum pump would not have to be a monster to get the job done. While you are at it, go electric and boil your wort under a vacuum as well. I think at lest one of them has tried all of that. I am not joking. |
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Post by Ken on May 19, 2020 8:02:06 GMT -6
Has a low 02 brewer made a vacuum chamber for their mash tun yet? I expect it would not be hard to do. I do not think you would have to take heroic measures and the vacuum pump would not have to be a monster to get the job done. While you are at it, go electric and boil your wort under a vacuum as well. I think at lest one of them has tried all of that. I am not joking. Yeah, browsing that forum is breath-taking in its scope of experiments and O2-fidgeting. They have put an unbelievable amount of thought into almost every single aspect of brewing in terms of O2. I was lucky to find a group of guys who were a little more laid-back and instead of saying that "every single rule has to be followed to the letter", they suggested ways to start small and make the changes that you could based on the system you have and make changes in steps, etc. I still do some of the LO steps and I have abandoned others. I'm happy with my beers. |
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Post by zymot on May 19, 2020 8:11:00 GMT -6
[I think at lest one of them has tried all of that. I am not joking. If you had access to a laboratory vacuum chamber, you could get a a pretty good idea about what it would take using scaled tests. |
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Post by zymot on May 19, 2020 8:14:02 GMT -6
I think at lest one of them has tried all of that. I am not joking. Yeah, browsing that forum is breath-taking in its scope of experiments and O2-fidgeting. They have put an unbelievable amount of thought into almost every single aspect of brewing in terms of O2. I was lucky to find a group of guys who were a little more laid-back and instead of saying that "every single rule has to be followed to the letter", they suggested ways to start small and make the changes that you could based on the system you have and make changes in steps, etc. I still do some of the LO steps and I have abandoned others. I'm happy with my beers. Home brewers tend to confuse optimum or best practice with failure to comply = undrinkable, ruined beer. |
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Post by Leftympfrmde on May 19, 2020 9:02:30 GMT -6
Has a low 02 brewer made a vacuum chamber for their mash tun yet? I expect it would not be hard to do. I do not think you would have to take heroic measures and the vacuum pump would not have to be a monster to get the job done. While you are at it, go electric and boil your wort under a vacuum as well. Just finished a electric brewery build from scratch; the last thing I wanna do is more tinkering at the moment lol |
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Post by Ken on May 19, 2020 9:12:08 GMT -6
I don't pretend to understand all of these steps, their impact on the beer, etc. but I'm sure there are a lot of variables. It's possible that my beer has always been somewhat oxidized (it seems VERY likely) and when I made the LO changes my beer was less oxidized but still oxidized and when I moved away from the water deoxygenation the change in my beer was so slight that it was not perceivable. Another set of variables: your tastebuds and what they decide to do that day, what you had to eat, whether you're sick or on medication, your mood and the alignment of the planets. One day I might drink one of my beers and think that I taste something that seems off and the next day that very same beer tastes excellent. Who knows. I have always said that if one was unhappy with their beers then there are plenty of places online to look for solutions and if you're happy with your beers, stop tinkering with them.
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Post by jkor on May 19, 2020 9:50:07 GMT -6
Has a low 02 brewer made a vacuum chamber for their mash tun yet? I expect it would not be hard to do. I do not think you would have to take heroic measures and the vacuum pump would not have to be a monster to get the job done. While you are at it, go electric and boil your wort under a vacuum as well. I think at lest one of them has tried all of that. I am not joking. The amount of vacuum needed to effectively eliminate all oxygen contact would collapse anything I've ever seen used as a mash tun. Sealing and purging with inert gas would likely be far more effective IMO. |
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Post by jkor on May 19, 2020 9:53:26 GMT -6
I don't pretend to understand all of these steps, their impact on the beer, etc. but I'm sure there are a lot of variables. It's possible that my beer has always been somewhat oxidized (it seems VERY likely) and when I made the LO changes my beer was less oxidized but still oxidized and when I moved away from the water deoxygenation the change in my beer was so slight that it was not perceivable. Another set of variables: your tastebuds and what they decide to do that day, what you had to eat, whether you're sick or on medication, your mood and the alignment of the planets. One day I might drink one of my beers and think that I taste something that seems off and the next day that very same beer tastes excellent. Who knows. I have always said that if one was unhappy with their beers then there are plenty of places online to look for solutions and if you're happy with your beers, stop tinkering with them. Yeah, my question is whether all this low DO effort makes a noticeable improvement in the beer. It might change the beer but is it actually improving it to the person drinking it? If you need to use a mass spectrometer to know that it has less oxidation byproducts then it seem like a lot of work for nothing. |
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Post by Ken on May 19, 2020 10:17:51 GMT -6
I don't pretend to understand all of these steps, their impact on the beer, etc. but I'm sure there are a lot of variables. It's possible that my beer has always been somewhat oxidized (it seems VERY likely) and when I made the LO changes my beer was less oxidized but still oxidized and when I moved away from the water deoxygenation the change in my beer was so slight that it was not perceivable. Another set of variables: your tastebuds and what they decide to do that day, what you had to eat, whether you're sick or on medication, your mood and the alignment of the planets. One day I might drink one of my beers and think that I taste something that seems off and the next day that very same beer tastes excellent. Who knows. I have always said that if one was unhappy with their beers then there are plenty of places online to look for solutions and if you're happy with your beers, stop tinkering with them. Yeah, my question is whether all this low DO effort makes a noticeable improvement in the beer. It might change the beer but is it actually improving it to the person drinking it? If you need to use a mass spectrometer to know that it has less oxidation byproducts then it seem like a lot of work for nothing. Yeah, you bring up something that's on my mind often. The LO guys are passionate about this and I believe that they are more than "backyard scientists" as they have been called. They try very hard to make sure that all of their assertions are backed by science so that there is no question. That said, they can't tell everyone what to taste. They can't tell people that their beer tastes good or bad. Yes they can say that this beer has less dissolved O2 than this beer and their meter proves it. But if those two glasses of beer are sitting in front of me and they both taste good to me... now what? I started down this road because I had a beer in a keg that I bottled with a cobra tap. Those bottles sat in the fridge for 3-4 months and then I took some to a party. They tasted stale and oxidized. It was most certainly from the bottling. But it made me want to [at least] look into the LO ideas. If I'm going to shit-talk something I at least want to be able to say that I researched it and I tried to follow the rules. Many people have dismissed these ideas without even attempting to accept them or follow them and I can't understand that part. |
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Post by Seven on May 19, 2020 10:56:18 GMT -6
I've read and dabbled a bit in some LODO practices and I think they've made some differences but it's anecdotal at best. One counter-argument I often see is that if LODO beers were so much better, why aren't they racking up homebrew awards? To me, the benefit of reading LODO info is in evaluating and cleaning up my processes.
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. They did some studies on another board and I think the time to 0ppm was 20 minutes. 
